So this inspired me to listen to Andre 3000 and wow his latest does not disappoint o.o
I also deeply relate to your approach to creating a masterpiece — I either have 3 or 1 full-length books in me (maybe a 3-in-1?), and tbh part of why I started writing on Substack was to develop the habits of writing that will eventually allow me to write a real book.
Also in general I'm a fan of rest, slowness, intention; basically Satya's Going Gently approach. It's lovely to see you take your time with this project. I think it'll be so much better because of it.
Well it would take the form of a story about a boy who learns to love without all the baggage I grew up with. A sort of redemption arc or alternative history of myself. But in order to create some distance and universalize the experience, I'd also place this boy in the utopian solarpunk world I'm trying to imagine (that authors like Claudia and Cheyenne and Robinson are pioneering). Honestly Le Guin is one of my biggest inspirations. Her worlds are so satisfyingly different from our own, and I would die to live in several of them, but she's quite clear that none of them are heaven; that even in (what we would consider) utopia, there is conflict and struggle and challenge enough for good novel-wrjting.
So that's what I wanna do: show that it's possible to grow up completely free from the (sexual/emotional/psychological) wounds we take for granted, and that such a life, in a future world, would still be full of its own unique challenges.
The masterpiece pressure is too much for me. I’m in pursuit of solid and fun. I want to entertain people and feel like I have potentially infinite books in me. I think also if a writer is your fav writer, you’d gladly read tons of books by them. And we never know who may love our books or who they will touch.
But I get wanting to take more time.
I’m def not a writer who can release a book a month and even yearly is really pushing it for me. I also put a lot of my own intellectual explorations into my novels, maybe too much.
Wow, you are so prolific!!!! Sometimes I wish I was more like that with my fiction. (Like when I'm reading Sarah J Maas and am jealous that she could just spend 20 years writing 20 books that are all incredible haha). But it's not my sole love.
Also, each book has its own pace. I once wrote the first draft of a novel in 14 days. Another one took me 10 years and still isn’t published. May never be published.
My latest took 2 years of off and on work to finish.
One before that took about 1 year, but I was pushing it too hard and felt burnt out.
It’s technically finished. Had an agent and a publisher but then the deal fell through during Covid and the agency folded and it was very frustrating. So I’ll prob return to it one day, but it also got fiddled with by so many people that I’m not excited about it anymore.
Wow. That is SO FRUSTRATING!!!! I can't believe that happened with your agent! And that the book was so altered in the process that you don't even love it anymore.
I've always been resistant to editors for the very reason you mentioned. I once had someone email me a list of everything she hated about my book Oblivion and the only thing I could think when I read it was, "if I edited the book to be how you like it, then the book wouldn't be how I like it."
Also fun fact: a lot of the greats didn't have editors. They just wrote what they wanted and a publisher published them!
Yep. I warn everyone now who asks me to only go with agents, publishers, and editors with extensive track records, like multiple bestsellers. And interview a few of their other authors before you commit. Otherwise I don’t think it’s worth the stress.
Bravo. I am constantly amazed at how long it takes to write fiction. Donna Tartt takes about 10 years for her novels. Robert Heinlein worked on “Stranger in a Strange Land” for decades. My fiction writing process has slowed way down because it takes painstaking effort to remove the preachiness and agenda in favor of art.
When starting to write with a concept in mind, I think it’s harder. Because a story needs… story. Characters, plot. Starting with worldbuilding is again difficult. Especially when it’s very complex. Everything the characters do needs to be embedded in that secondary world. And building the minutiae of daily life in a secondary world takes so much effort.
Totally! This happened with Huxley’s “Island” as well. Fortunately, a disconnect is brewing between the men’s expectations and the women’s life experiences. It’s believable and tragic.
Also - I'm just finishing "Herland." I've loved it from the beginning, though the later chapters drag a bit. Not much happening, just conversations to impart information about education, child care, religion. It reminds me of the problem with Huxley's "Island," and perhaps all utopian novels - nothing changes. And stories are about change - that's what we expect as readers. Yes, the men changed their minds about the women of "Herland" and even about the assumed superiority of their home culture. Not sure it's enough. I'm curious how you're thinking about it these days. And are you tempted to read the sequel, "Ourland," where the women return with the guys to the U.S.? (Another side-effect of reading it has been my increased frustration with how things really are, when clearly, these women have it all figured out and why can't we just live like that??) 😥
As you might've noticed, I'm currently reading 'Dune' with other writers. It took Frank Herbert six years of dedicated work to write this novel. He became an ecologist in the process and later on built his own sustainable house and dubbed himself a techno-peasant. Despite all the criticism around his writing style etc., his story remains a masterpiece because it meant something to him. It was more than just a novel. This is how I aspire to write as well.
And from what I read in this piece, this is how you aspire to write yourself. And I think it's wonderful. Fiction writers can be entertainers, but they can also be philosophers. In any case, to write a good book, the advice to 'write what you know' is sound advice.
This year I want to focus on finishing my first book and I decided not to write much else. Once I have a good draft of all the remaining stories, I will start refining and publishing them one by one. If I don't do this, I will never finish my book. My newsletter might suffer in the meantime, but this is the decision I had to take.
I’ve only been publishing poems for 8 months on this platform. One of the interesting things I’ve seen recently, and maybe it’s a new years thing, is many writers here shifting their newsletter. At first, as a reader of someone, it makes me wonder if I’ll continue to find value in it. But that’s kind of a BS thought...if so, so what? It’s their art. And more often then not, seeing the bravery to shift mid stride and still put it out there is inspiring. So, kudos to you both!
I also saw many writers shifting their newsletter.
With my newsletter, my goal was from the beginning to write 'There Is Hope', my first book. I want to focus on delivering this promise.
My second focus this year is the non-fiction series about climate change in the Holocene: I have two episodes left. It's also something promised.
After these two projects are done, I will continue with the rest of my projects: I have an AI novella and a cli-fi novel.
I have so many other ideas for what I want to write on Story Voyager. But I need to focus on what I already announced that I will publish. What I meant with 'my newsletter will suffer' is that I will not publish other stuff than the above and I will also not spend a lot of time on Notes. :) I hope that this answers your comment.
I never knew that about Herbert, but I respect that so much! Books should be philosophy! That's what makes them so rich to me!
I love what you are doing with your book, that's what I did with my first book two. It was my only side hobby for three years. I only started this newsletter once I had finished it!
I came to the same realisation recently too. I realised that while I've been writing fiction since 2000, and may still want to write SOME fiction, I no longer want to write fiction exclusiely on my Substack. For some reason, I never thought I could pivot from this stance. I've always been one who tries to be "disciplined about things", mostly because I seem to flit from interest to interest, and I tried to be consistent with my fiction writing result. But we should follow where our muse leads us and sometimes the places are unexpected. I was waiting eagerly for this and you did not dissapoint ;)
It's so strange how we commit ourselves to things and then feel like we can't break our own commitments for something better. I appreciate our dedication 😆 but we have got to be able to adapt and evolve! 😊
Love this sentiment. I’m currently grappling with how to improve my writing and haven’t posted as much fiction lately because I’m realizing that I don’t just want to regurgitate ideas but to craft something unique or timeless. Whether I can achieve that remains to be seen, but embracing the journey has been enlightening. Thanks, Elle, for the inspiration!
That is a great outlook on writing a novel. If it is not your livelihood, why not take the time to make it great? You continue to inspire.
Love the honesty
So this inspired me to listen to Andre 3000 and wow his latest does not disappoint o.o
I also deeply relate to your approach to creating a masterpiece — I either have 3 or 1 full-length books in me (maybe a 3-in-1?), and tbh part of why I started writing on Substack was to develop the habits of writing that will eventually allow me to write a real book.
Also in general I'm a fan of rest, slowness, intention; basically Satya's Going Gently approach. It's lovely to see you take your time with this project. I think it'll be so much better because of it.
Right? What an album!
I'm curious: Do you know what kind of book(s) you want to write? I ask because I know I would love yours...
Well it would take the form of a story about a boy who learns to love without all the baggage I grew up with. A sort of redemption arc or alternative history of myself. But in order to create some distance and universalize the experience, I'd also place this boy in the utopian solarpunk world I'm trying to imagine (that authors like Claudia and Cheyenne and Robinson are pioneering). Honestly Le Guin is one of my biggest inspirations. Her worlds are so satisfyingly different from our own, and I would die to live in several of them, but she's quite clear that none of them are heaven; that even in (what we would consider) utopia, there is conflict and struggle and challenge enough for good novel-wrjting.
So that's what I wanna do: show that it's possible to grow up completely free from the (sexual/emotional/psychological) wounds we take for granted, and that such a life, in a future world, would still be full of its own unique challenges.
That sounds absolutely incredible. If you write it I'll share it everywhere. :)
Thank you so much! That means a lot ✨
The masterpiece pressure is too much for me. I’m in pursuit of solid and fun. I want to entertain people and feel like I have potentially infinite books in me. I think also if a writer is your fav writer, you’d gladly read tons of books by them. And we never know who may love our books or who they will touch.
But I get wanting to take more time.
I’m def not a writer who can release a book a month and even yearly is really pushing it for me. I also put a lot of my own intellectual explorations into my novels, maybe too much.
Wow, you are so prolific!!!! Sometimes I wish I was more like that with my fiction. (Like when I'm reading Sarah J Maas and am jealous that she could just spend 20 years writing 20 books that are all incredible haha). But it's not my sole love.
Trust me, I too wish I was more prolific. I’m slow compared to many.
In pursuit of solid and fun. I like this a lot. Taking away the pressure of perfection. Which is anyway an illusion.
Also, each book has its own pace. I once wrote the first draft of a novel in 14 days. Another one took me 10 years and still isn’t published. May never be published.
My latest took 2 years of off and on work to finish.
One before that took about 1 year, but I was pushing it too hard and felt burnt out.
What do you think about the book that took 10 years? Do you still want to finish it?
It’s technically finished. Had an agent and a publisher but then the deal fell through during Covid and the agency folded and it was very frustrating. So I’ll prob return to it one day, but it also got fiddled with by so many people that I’m not excited about it anymore.
Wow. That is SO FRUSTRATING!!!! I can't believe that happened with your agent! And that the book was so altered in the process that you don't even love it anymore.
I've always been resistant to editors for the very reason you mentioned. I once had someone email me a list of everything she hated about my book Oblivion and the only thing I could think when I read it was, "if I edited the book to be how you like it, then the book wouldn't be how I like it."
Also fun fact: a lot of the greats didn't have editors. They just wrote what they wanted and a publisher published them!
Yep. I warn everyone now who asks me to only go with agents, publishers, and editors with extensive track records, like multiple bestsellers. And interview a few of their other authors before you commit. Otherwise I don’t think it’s worth the stress.
Very sound advice.
Bravo. I am constantly amazed at how long it takes to write fiction. Donna Tartt takes about 10 years for her novels. Robert Heinlein worked on “Stranger in a Strange Land” for decades. My fiction writing process has slowed way down because it takes painstaking effort to remove the preachiness and agenda in favor of art.
When starting to write with a concept in mind, I think it’s harder. Because a story needs… story. Characters, plot. Starting with worldbuilding is again difficult. Especially when it’s very complex. Everything the characters do needs to be embedded in that secondary world. And building the minutiae of daily life in a secondary world takes so much effort.
Totally! This happened with Huxley’s “Island” as well. Fortunately, a disconnect is brewing between the men’s expectations and the women’s life experiences. It’s believable and tragic.
Also - I'm just finishing "Herland." I've loved it from the beginning, though the later chapters drag a bit. Not much happening, just conversations to impart information about education, child care, religion. It reminds me of the problem with Huxley's "Island," and perhaps all utopian novels - nothing changes. And stories are about change - that's what we expect as readers. Yes, the men changed their minds about the women of "Herland" and even about the assumed superiority of their home culture. Not sure it's enough. I'm curious how you're thinking about it these days. And are you tempted to read the sequel, "Ourland," where the women return with the guys to the U.S.? (Another side-effect of reading it has been my increased frustration with how things really are, when clearly, these women have it all figured out and why can't we just live like that??) 😥
God I know. Why do all the utopian novels have to be so boring!? Surely we can come up with better ones! 🤓
Herland is still my favorite, but I have no plans to read Ourland. You're right, the women have it figured out. Let's just live like that!!!!
Herland did finish strong. Even had some (well-foreshadowed) drama and conflict near the end. A clash of expectations and reality.
Totally! Glad to hear you liked it!
As you might've noticed, I'm currently reading 'Dune' with other writers. It took Frank Herbert six years of dedicated work to write this novel. He became an ecologist in the process and later on built his own sustainable house and dubbed himself a techno-peasant. Despite all the criticism around his writing style etc., his story remains a masterpiece because it meant something to him. It was more than just a novel. This is how I aspire to write as well.
And from what I read in this piece, this is how you aspire to write yourself. And I think it's wonderful. Fiction writers can be entertainers, but they can also be philosophers. In any case, to write a good book, the advice to 'write what you know' is sound advice.
This year I want to focus on finishing my first book and I decided not to write much else. Once I have a good draft of all the remaining stories, I will start refining and publishing them one by one. If I don't do this, I will never finish my book. My newsletter might suffer in the meantime, but this is the decision I had to take.
I’ve only been publishing poems for 8 months on this platform. One of the interesting things I’ve seen recently, and maybe it’s a new years thing, is many writers here shifting their newsletter. At first, as a reader of someone, it makes me wonder if I’ll continue to find value in it. But that’s kind of a BS thought...if so, so what? It’s their art. And more often then not, seeing the bravery to shift mid stride and still put it out there is inspiring. So, kudos to you both!
I also saw many writers shifting their newsletter.
With my newsletter, my goal was from the beginning to write 'There Is Hope', my first book. I want to focus on delivering this promise.
My second focus this year is the non-fiction series about climate change in the Holocene: I have two episodes left. It's also something promised.
After these two projects are done, I will continue with the rest of my projects: I have an AI novella and a cli-fi novel.
I have so many other ideas for what I want to write on Story Voyager. But I need to focus on what I already announced that I will publish. What I meant with 'my newsletter will suffer' is that I will not publish other stuff than the above and I will also not spend a lot of time on Notes. :) I hope that this answers your comment.
Love it!
I never knew that about Herbert, but I respect that so much! Books should be philosophy! That's what makes them so rich to me!
I love what you are doing with your book, that's what I did with my first book two. It was my only side hobby for three years. I only started this newsletter once I had finished it!
Yes, writing takes time. I’m enjoying the process right now. Good luck with your utopian writing.
Love this
I came to the same realisation recently too. I realised that while I've been writing fiction since 2000, and may still want to write SOME fiction, I no longer want to write fiction exclusiely on my Substack. For some reason, I never thought I could pivot from this stance. I've always been one who tries to be "disciplined about things", mostly because I seem to flit from interest to interest, and I tried to be consistent with my fiction writing result. But we should follow where our muse leads us and sometimes the places are unexpected. I was waiting eagerly for this and you did not dissapoint ;)
It's so strange how we commit ourselves to things and then feel like we can't break our own commitments for something better. I appreciate our dedication 😆 but we have got to be able to adapt and evolve! 😊
Listening to the Andre 3000 album now. I didn’t know it had released.
Love this sentiment. I’m currently grappling with how to improve my writing and haven’t posted as much fiction lately because I’m realizing that I don’t just want to regurgitate ideas but to craft something unique or timeless. Whether I can achieve that remains to be seen, but embracing the journey has been enlightening. Thanks, Elle, for the inspiration!
Right! Essays are much better at being timely. Books are much better at being timeless!